But wouldn't you also agree that in the interim minority reports by
highly-credentialed people on a key issue should be made a matter of record
along with majority reports so that reviewers could see all the data found
by the experts and their various opinions and conclusions?  "People being
people," academia I presume must not be totally free of various degrees
"corruption" itself.  For example, for an extreme case, see:
http://www.mcrkba.org/Bellesiles.html
Mark

On Sun, May 4, 2008 at 11:47 AM, Stephan A. Schwartz <
[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> Historical data, absent the discovery of some as yet unknown but
> definitive documentation, will not get us to an answer. On that we should,
> surely, all agree at this point. Only science will settle this and, based on
> my reading of that literature, I believe it will, within the next 10-15
> years. Personally, I think it is a question we should put aside until some
> new factor is introduced into the equation.
>
> -- Stephan
>
>
> On 4 May 2008, at 09:03, DFM wrote:
>
>  In a little book called Jefferson at Monticello. The private life of
> > Thomas Jefferson,  the author addresses the question of TJ and a slave-girl
> > lover and he says that he often saw someone else, never Jefferson, leaving
> > that slave's abode in the early morning.
> > The author of this little book was Jefferson's overseer for many years
> > and he saw a lot of what went on around the place. He does not say precisely
> > who it was that he saw darting out of her room but he says that it was not
> > Thomas Jefferson.
> > It seems to me that just like there are those who refuse to believe that
> > TJ fooled around with the slaves, there are those who refuse to consider
> > that he did not.
> > Deane Mills
> > Yorktown, VA
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Mark Wilson" <[log in to unmask]>
> > To: <[log in to unmask]>
> > Sent: Sunday, May 04, 2008 1:37 AM
> > Subject: Re: DNA In Jefferson-Hemings controversy
> >
> >
> > Is it not possible that TJ had a secret sexual relationship with another
> > (or
> > others over the years?) rather than with apparently the relatively
> > convenient SH?
> >
> > On the other hand, TJ was already among an extremely small percentage of
> > humanity at one end of the Bell curve in certain human characteristics.
> >  He
> > was not your run-of-the-mill ordinary guy. Could he not have also have
> > been
> > among those fewer numbers of men tending to be mostly sexually inactive
> > in
> > later life - whether for medical or other reasons?  For example,
> > although
> > "people will be people" most Popes, especially recent ones, appear to
> > have
> > been people who were celibate - even though over the centuries not all
> > have
> > been found to be so - and even though maybe more than we know were not
> > so.
> >
> > We may project certain characteristics upon the masses of humanity with
> > some
> > degree of accuracy, but when trying to say the same things about one man
> > or
> > one woman we run a much greater risk of inaccuracy.  Some are willing to
> > make such leaps - other are not.  I believe the wiser choice is to not
> > make
> > such leaps.
> >
> > Of course some folks die before the answers ("truths") are known.  Some
> > of
> > us may go that route before any new DNA methods or evidence "proves"
> > which
> > beliefs about TJ were correct.  (I hate it when humans pass from the
> > scene
> > before knowing the answer "for sure" because it means that I may
> > eventually
> > be among them in things I'd really like to know - but "C'est la vie,"
> > eh?)
> >
> > Mark
> >
> > On Sat, May 3, 2008 at 7:49 PM, Stephan A. Schwartz <
> > [log in to unmask]> wrote:
> >
> >  Herbert --
> > >
> > > Thank you for this lengthy exegesis on this subject. Much of it I
> > > knew,
> > > but some I did not. Let me reduce my thinking to a parsimonious
> > > essence. The
> > > present day DNA data is highly suggestive but not despositive.
> > > However, the
> > > science of genetics is advancing now with a speed that is reminiscent
> > > of
> > > laser development — in the 1960s and 70s — when they had to publish
> > > the time
> > > and date the paper was submitted because there was a chance it had
> > > been
> > > super-ceded by the time it was through the peer-review and publication
> > > cycle. There is much more we are going to learn from DNA inquiry. Of
> > > that, I
> > > think, we can be sure. There will be new and better tests yielding
> > > clearer,
> > > deeper insights.  Who did what in the beginning of this approach, a
> > > decade
> > > from now will become a not terribly important part of the narrative,
> > > except
> > > as it reveals various prejudices of the day. We must be patient until
> > > new
> > > data emerges. This is like discussing a baseball game in the seventh
> > > inning.
> > >
> > > One thing I do know. People do not live in a Tolstoian village like
> > > Monticello without all of the people in the household having a
> > > relationship,
> > > and Sally Hemings and Thomas Jefferson had to have had one. Her status
> > > as
> > > his chambermaid assured that.
> > >
> > > So I guess it gets down to whether you think he would be capable of
> > > such a
> > > relationship? People today have sexual relationships  all the time
> > > with
> > > individuals with whom they are far less involved than Jefferson was
> > > with
> > > Sally. And the same was true in the Elizabethan Age. Between 1558 and
> > > 1603,
> > > in the Country of Essex, which had approximately 40,000 adults, almost
> > > 38
> > > per cent — 15,000 — were cited for sexual misbehavior. And it will be
> > > true
> > > 50 years from now. People are people, and I think Jefferson no
> > > different. Do
> > > you think he was a celibate? Was it coercive? By definition. But while
> > > I can
> > > see Jefferson as a man with secret sexual relationship, I cannot see
> > > him as
> > > a serial rapist, so some accommodation was reached.
> > >
> > > Does this make him evil. I don't think so. Thomas Jefferson, no less
> > > that
> > > the other Founders, with the exception of Franklin, was a man of his
> > > time,
> > > status, and culture. What has always amazed me about these
> > > individuals, is
> > > that they risked everything and, in the end, rose above who they were
> > > to
> > > craft what they bequeathed us. Their modernity and relevance, lies in
> > > the
> > > question they eternally pose: Would I, could I, do the same?
> > >
> > > -- Stephan
> > >
> >
> > - - - s n i p - - -
> >
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