Well, if the Kingfish does prevail, my friends living on this barrier island in Northern Florida, are suggesting, in jest I assume, that we blow up the bridge to the mainland and declare our independence.? I guess they are suggesting secession, although in jest. J South -----Original Message----- From: Anne Pemberton <[log in to unmask]> To: [log in to unmask] Sent: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 7:37 pm Subject: Re: 10132106Z08 Articles 9 And 10 And 1st Amendment J. South,? ? Well, it seems that Virginia has the opportunity to be the king-maker next month, and the polls are leaning towards Obama. Far better to have an intelligent man with less experience, than a foolish old man with only a little more experience and non in an executive position. That said, I will say no more about the pending election, except that I am hoping for a grassroots win.? ? Anne? ? Anne Pemberton? [log in to unmask] http://www.erols.com/apembert? http://www.educationalsynthesis.org? ----- Original Message ----- From: <[log in to unmask]>? To: <[log in to unmask]>? Sent: Monday, October 13, 2008 7:30 PM? Subject: Re: 10132106Z08 Articles 9 And 10 And 1st Amendment? ? > Yes, the Federal Forts, and particularly Sumter, were given to the Federal > government by the states.? Sumter was given by South Carolina on the > condition that certain maintenance and improvements would be made to it, > which the US failed to comply with.? >? > The Oval Office is not a place for on the job training for former > community organizers or former state governors who don't know their way > around DC or the Federal goverment.? >? > J South? >? >? >? >? >? >? >? > -----Original Message-----? > From: Anne Pemberton <[log in to unmask]>? > To: [log in to unmask] > Sent: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 7:26 pm? > Subject: Re: 10132106Z08 Articles 9 And 10 And 1st Amendment? >? >? >? >? >? >? >? >? >? > J. South,?? > ?? >? > Everyone elected to the presidency is "inexperienced" in some degree or? > another, unless they have served already, in which case, they can be > judged? > on their record.?? > ?? >? > Why did the south want the federal forts to be surrended to them anyway? > Had? > they paid for them? Resupplying a fort is not reason to fire on it. It is? > reason to ask what is going on and set another date, if desired, to? > surrender the fort. But, the term "surrender" suggests that the south? > expected it to be a gift. What consideration were they giving for this > fort??? > ?? >? > Anne?? > ?? >? > Anne Pemberton?? >? > [log in to unmask] >? > http://www.erols.com/apembert?? >? > http://www.educationalsynthesis.org?? >? > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <[log in to unmask]>?? >? > To: <[log in to unmask]>?? >? > Sent: Monday, October 13, 2008 7:17 PM?? >? > Subject: Re: 10132106Z08 Articles 9 And 10 And 1st Amendment?? > ?? >? >? >> Nice analysis of history.? Sounds like it was written by Seward.?? >? >>?? >? >> The peaceful surrender of Fort Sumter was arranged for April 15th.? Then? >> Lincoln, et. al., thought they would be cute and try to resupply the fort? >> with troops and arms under the noses of the South Carolina militia.? The? >> approach of the ships triggered the firing.? The firing triggered another? >> brilliant Lincoln move of calling for troops from all the states in the? >> Union, including Virginia, Kentucky, Tennessee and North Carolina, to? >> invade the South.?? >? >>?? >? >> Lincoln handled the secession crisis with all the finesse of a bull in a? >> china shop, and was personally responsible for the deaths of? >> 600,000-700,000 brave American men.? A good lesson on why not to elect? >> inexperienced politicians to the presidency during times of crisis, or >> any? >> other time for that matter.?? >? >>?? >? >> J South?? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >> -----Original Message-----?? >? >> From: Anne Pemberton <[log in to unmask]>?? >? >> To: [log in to unmask] >? >> Sent: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 6:23 pm?? >? >> Subject: Re: 10132106Z08 Articles 9 And 10 And 1st Amendment?? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >> Walter,??? >? >> ??? >? >>?? >? >> Your qualifications are worth noting. President Lincoln did not? >> willy-nilly?? >? >> call out an army, but acted with caution and reason in response to the?? >? >> demands to take over federal propery, such as Fort Sumpter, and such. >> For?? >? >> the life of me, I do not understand why the south pretends they were put?? >? >> upon by the war, when it was the south that fired the first shot. Had >> the?? >? >> south responded with courtesy and restraint with the commander at Fort?? >? >> Sumpter, who was in the right to continue his presence until recalled by? >> his?? >? >> commander in chief, they could have averted the blood shed. The south >> was?? >? >> out for blood, and they got it!??? >? >> ??? >? >>?? >? >> Anne??? >? >> ??? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >> Anne Pemberton??? >? >>?? >? >> [log in to unmask] >? >>?? >? >> http://www.erols.com/apembert??? >? >>?? >? >> http://www.educationalsynthesis.org??? >? >>?? >? >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Walter Waddell" <[log in to unmask]>??? >? >>?? >? >> To: <[log in to unmask]>??? >? >>?? >? >> Sent: Monday, October 13, 2008 5:09 PM??? >? >>?? >? >> Subject: 10132106Z08 Articles 9 And 10 And 1st Amendment??? >? >> ??? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >>> "Lincoln never gave the US courts the opportunity to render an opinion >>> on?? >? >>> the Constitutionality of secession.? He??? >? >>?? >? >>> just summarily called for the raising of an army to invade the >>> initially?? >? >>> seceding states --"??? >? >>?? >? >>>??? >? >>?? >? >>> The statement does not suit for any general examination of a timeline >>> for?? >? >>> a "dejure" secessionist argument since??? >? >>?? >? >>> both officials and ordinary citizens of several seceding states had?? >? >>> engaged and or were engaging in acts of??? >? >>?? >? >>> violence against Federal persons and property.??? >? >>?? >? >>>??? >? >>?? >? >>> An argument for secession must be incident free of any act of violence >>> or?? >? >>> call for violence to achieve credible??? >? >>?? >? >>> review as provided for by the words set forth throughout the U. S.?? >? >>> Constitution -- using a literal reading thereof.??? >? >>?? >? >>>??? >? >>?? >? >>> ______________________________________??? >? >>?? >? >>> To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe please see the >>> instructions?? >? >>> at??? >? >>?? >? >>> http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html ??? >? >>?? >? >> ______________________________________??? >? >>?? >? >> To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe please see the instructions? >> at??? >? >>?? >? >> http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html??? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >>?? >? >> ______________________________________?? >? >> To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe please see the instructions? >> at?? >? >> http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html ?? >? > ______________________________________?? >? > To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe please see the instructions > at?? >? > http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html?? >? >? >? >? >? >? > ______________________________________? > To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe please see the instructions > at? > http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html ? ______________________________________? To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe please see the instructions at? http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html? ______________________________________ To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe please see the instructions at http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html