My question is what did Islam have to do with Europeans enslaving Indians? No one seems to want to answer that. Anita >From: macbd1 <[log in to unmask]> >Reply-To: Discussion of research and writing about Virginia history > <[log in to unmask]> >To: [log in to unmask] >Subject: Re: Islamic Slavery (was Re: Slavery and immoral stance, etc.) >Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2007 11:06:13 -0500 > >Let's not be so kind. > >While European involvement in the Transatlantic slave trade to the Americas >(that included Virginia) lasted for just over three centuries, the Arab >involvement in slave trade lasted *fourteen* centuries, and in some parts >of >the Muslim world is still continuing to this day. Over 28 Million Africans >have been enslaved in the Muslim world during this time, with some >estimates >being 'much' higher. A comparison of the Muslim slave trade to the >American >slave trade reveals some interesting contrasts. > >While two out of every three slaves shipped across the Atlantic were men, >the proportions were reversed in the Muslim slave trade. Two women for >every >man were enslaved by the Muslims. > >While the mortality rate for slaves being transported across the Atlantic >was as high as 10%, the percentage of slaves dying in transit in the >Transsahara and East African slave trade was between 80 and 90%! > >While almost all the slaves shipped across the Atlantic were for >agricultural work, most of the slaves destined for the Muslim Middle East >were for sexual exploitation as concubines, in harems, and for military >service. > >While many children were born to slaves in the Americas, and millions of >their descendants are citizens in Brazil and the USA to this day, very few >descendants of the slaves that ended up in the Middle East survive. (Maybe >they were just "incorporated into society," huh??) > >While most slaves who went to the Americas could marry and have families, >most of the male slaves destined for the Middle East were castrated, and >most of the children born to the women were killed at birth. > >Of the estimated 11 million Africans transported across the Atlantic (the >actual number is debatable), approximately 95% went to South and Central >America, mainly to Portuguese, Spanish and French possessions. >'Only' 4-5% of the total were transported to what was to become >The United States. (It seems terrible to discuss slavery in statistical >terms.) > >While Christian Reformers spearheaded the antislavery abolitionist >movements >in Europe and North America, and Great Britain mobilized her Navy, >throughout most of the 19th Century, to intercept slave ships and set >captives free, there was no comparable opposition to slavery within the >Muslim world. > >Even after Britain outlawed the slave trade in 1807 and Europe abolished >the >slave trade in 1815, Muslim slave traders enslaved a further 2 million >Africans. This despite vigorous British Naval activity and military >intervention to limit the Muslim slave trade. > >By some calculations the number of victims of the 14 centuries of Muslim >slave trade could exceed 180 million. Nearly 100 years after President >Abraham Lincoln issued the Emancipation Proclamation in America, and 130 >years after all slaves within the British Empire were set free by >parliamentary decree, Saudi Arabia and Yemen, in 1962, and Mauritania in >1980, begrudgingly removed legalized slavery from their statute books. > >And this only after international pressure was brought to bear. Today >numerous international organizations (and news media) document that slavery >in its worst terms still continues in some Muslim countries -- like Darfur, >Sudan, Somalia, Mauritania and Chad among others. > >Much of the above statistical data from Assyrian International News >Agency's >study of many sources, some of which are available online. >http://www.aina.org/ > >My feelings about slavery was posted 3/2/07 during a prior thread >concerning >WPA Slave Narratives, see copy far below. With such strongly felt emotions >against slavery then and now, by many (including Southerners), wouldn't >Virginian historians and members at this list be better served to take >positive action against slavery yet existing in today's Muslim world than >trying to squeeze more and more out of apologies by today's society, >whether >or not their ancestors were slave owners? Emotions by common citizens of >our Southen States during the sorry times of our nation's Civil War >involved >more than slavery. It seems, for some, that 'something' will always be >lacking from today's apologies, including that of Virginia's >legislature....it's never quite enough.... > >With history discussions at this list repeating 'identical' topics and >commentary >about slavery, WPA slave narratives, etc quite often, a young visitor might >wonder whether anything else happened in Virginia's past. > >Neil McDonald > >----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Heinegg" <[log in to unmask]> >To: <[log in to unmask]> >Sent: Wednesday, June 13, 2007 6:03 PM >Subject: Re: [VA-HIST] Islamic Slavery (was Re: Slavery and immoral stance, >etc.) > > >>If you read Lovejoy or other works that discuss the Islamic trade in >>slaves >>from Africa to the Middle East, you may be--as I was--amazed to learn the >>huge numbers >>that were involved. >>------------- >>Segal estimates it to be about the same as the Atlantic trade, but it took >>place over eight centuries+. >> >>Many of the men were eunuchs. It is estimated that 1 in 200 potential >>eunuchs made it alive to their destinations. Those that survived were >>greatly revered in Muslim society, some becoming generals, heads of state, >>etc. In the early 20th century when eunuchs entered the tramcars in >>Istanbul, all Turks would stand and greet them, and remain standing until >>they took their seat. >> >>The survival rate from walking 2,500 miles across the Sahara from West >>Africa to Egypt or Northern Africa was, as you might imagine, much worse >>than the survival rate in the Atlantic trade on ships. >> >>Under pressure from the British the Turks closed the slave market in >>Istanbul in 1846, but in 1855 "the head of the Muslim community in Mecca >>issued a fatwa declaring that the ban was a breach of Islamic holy law and >>that the Turks were apostates and heathens upon whom it was obligatory to >>wage holy war." Slavery was still legal in Saudi in the 1950s and >>continued >>to some extent into the 1980s. It was replaced by hiring Filipino and >>Indian >>"house maids." When I worked in Saudi, I used to hear my Saudi work mates >>joking about taking advantage of their maids. >> >>I think the South has the same problem as the Saudis. Emancipation was >>enforced. The recent state legislature apologies to African Americans for >>the damage slavery did to the African American community both before and >>after slavery is a great stride toward ridding the soul of those past >>actions. The only thing that is lacking in the apologies is the >>acknowledgement of how wrong it was for their white ancestors in the 1860s >>to still be fighting to maintain slavery. One wonders when they would have >>agreed to emancipation if left to their own devices. >> >>Paul >> > >----- Original Message ----- From: "macbd1" <[log in to unmask]> >To: <[log in to unmask]> >Sent: Friday, March 02, 2007 1:11 PM >Subject: Re: [VA-HIST] Slave Narrative for WPA Project > > >>How can we allow, let alone participate in, such a bland discussion about >>basic human rights, where some even believe, or rather 'say,' that slaves >>were apparently happy with their plight. Human slavery and traumatic >>family upheaval and transportation, is/was such an abomination, so >>demeaning, so basically inhuman, so cruel, so wrong, so unacceptable. >>Freedom with liberty for all is man's ultimate way (it's sad that I feel >>inclined >>to add for this forum, meaning all of humankind.) Read the words and >>minds >>of those who violently rebelled, those who ran away, those who had the >>will >>and found the means for obtaining freedom or death, those who sacrificed >>so much in so many ways, to truly understand. Do the same for the many >>individuals who helped the rebels and runaways. Think about words of the >>old hymn, 'Free at Last,' and interpretations of many other 'old Negro >>spirituals' (historical context) of the early/mid 19th century. Read >>other >>sources, many on-line, for personal letters by slaves and ex-slaves. Look >>inside yourself and extrapolate the dots. >> >>Should we expect ex-slaves to have exclaimed: I believe it is >>self-evident, that all men are created equal, that we are endowed, by our >>Creator, with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, >>Liberty, >>and the pursuit of Happiness -- and, by God, never forget as to prevent >>slavery's recurrence or appearance elsewhere! >> >>Some conclusions simply don't require much discussion, IMHO. >> >>Neil McDonald >> >>An old Scotch-Irishman >>having early/mid-19th century ancestors >>just above Ripley, Ohio. _________________________________________________________________ Make every IM count. Download Messenger and join the i’m Initiative now. It’s free. http://im.live.com/messenger/im/home/?source=TAGHM_June07