The (SOUTH) had no slave ships. The (NORTH) had those. Lincoln made mistakes also. I forgive him. ----- Original Message ----- From: <[log in to unmask]> To: <[log in to unmask]> Sent: Friday, January 19, 2007 2:10 PM Subject: [VA-HIST] Apologies > As for me, to all the black members of this list, don't blame me, and > don't blame the south, but in whatever way I can apologize for myself > and my family, I apologize for what my people did to your people. It > was wrong. > Nancy > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > I agree completely with what Nancy has said here and I am descended, on both > sides of my family, from slave owners. I, personally, do not have any guilt > associated with that fact but I can tell you that I deeply regret and am > extremely sorry that my ancestors bought into that depraved system of > thinking and behaving and living. > I have quite a few African-American friends and although we only rarely > discuss the subject of slavery, they know how I feel and I am glad that they > know how I feel. I want them to know that I fully agree that slavery was an > evil institution. I want them to know that I KNOW that their people were > badly treated and that I find that fact totally reprehensible. > Oral histories still abound and some of the blacks living today have their > own set of family stories that got passed down. Those stories are starting > to die out as the black family has become so, so, so badly fractured by > wretched 20th century political and policy decisions that have done nothing > more than wreck and undermine the structure of the black family but, even > so, some of those stories are still out there and these folks KNOW what > happened to their families. They know. Just like I know certain things about > my ancestors who lived in Virginia and North Carolina in the 18th and 19th > centuries.....one was killed by Indians when he was watering his horse. > Another one hanged his own nephew when he deserted from the Confederate army > (the one doing the hanging was Captain of the Home Guard....a la Cold > Mountain). > As long as a particular family exists, if there are oral histories for that > family, they will usually get passed around and down one way or another. > The point I wish to make is that some African-Americans today, especially > the older ones who grew up intact families (intact families being an anomaly > for African-Americans today, obviously), still have these stories stored up > in their hearts and minds. > Frankly, I think it is an awesome tribute to American black people (I'm > getting REALLY politically incorrect here and that's too damn bad but I mean > this) that they are as forgiving and as gracious and as kindly toward white > people as they are. I mean, hell, The War is long over and I still hate > those damn Yankees! (Just kidding). > I don't know how exactly to word this but if an institution, like a state, > has not just condoned but actively participated in and built up a system > that was as enduring and as atrocious as the act of owning another human > being, then I see nothing wrong with, indeed, I see it as only helpful and > healthy to officially repent and even plead for forgiveness. Doing so would > be a giant step toward bringing Freedom to everyone involved. > Deane Mills > York County, VA > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Sunshine49" <[log in to unmask]> > To: <[log in to unmask]> > Sent: Friday, January 19, 2007 9:40 AM > Subject: Re: VIRGINIA LEGISLATURE > > > >I must disagree. I do agree that the PC movement has become too extreme, > >and it does nothing but create over-sensitivity, victimization, stifled > >communication, and resentment, depending on which side you're on. But, > >bottom line, what an apology for slavery deals with is human psychology. > >In a relationship, a person who has been wronged needs that sense of > >acknowledgment and validation of the wrongs done to them, even if it is > >decades later. It's stupid for an abuser to say oh, I knocked your teeth > >out 30 years ago, it's over and done, why don't you just get over it? As > >long as the wounds and resentment still fester, and the abuser refuses to > >say they did anything wrong, the issue will still exist. I think too many > >whites, in an attempt to protect themselves from being blamed for slavery, > >have created a bubble of insularity around themselves concerning the > >issue, and they have refused to see it anymore, other than in the > >abstract. I agree, neither I nor any other white today [with the exception > >of the ravening racists who still exist] should be "blamed" for slavery. > >But it did exist, it was a vile institution [but not one that should be > >blamed solely on the south, at had existed all over the colonies and has > >existed throughout man's history]. Read some of the original papers in > >courthouses and bring it to life for yourselves. How would you feel if it > >was your great- great grandfather's brothers, two little boys aged 8 and > >11, who were sold away from a farm in Amelia County? Ask yourselves how > >your gr-gr-gr- grandmother must have felt, to have her children torn away > >from her, probably never to be seen again? I think you'd be pretty > >resentful. Or if you read that, say, a Native American in Charlotte County > >in the 1850s was selling off a piece of land so he could establish > >himself in a slave business buying and selling your white ancestors, as if > >they were cattle or sheep. Herd 'em in, sell 'em off, make money. It would > >be pretty sickening. Or how about, perhaps, my own ancestor, maybe a > >Thomas Cardwell, stolen from his family back in Lancashire by slave > >raiders, chained in the hold of a fetid slave ship, groaning, sick, > >hungry, thirsty, listening to his fellow Englishmen around him dying, and > >emerging to a life where he could nevermore take a free step. I'd be > >pretty damned mad, let me tell you. It was abhorrent. We should apologize > >for it. But then both races need to move forward, I think of blacks and > >whites in this country as two people stuck in a bad marriage. So many > >issues, so many wounds, so much repressed anger. And they've stopped > >talking to each other about it. One lashes out, the other lashes back. > >Both only half-listen to the other, if that much, and they are no longer > >talking issues and problems, they are talking wounds. That's never good. > >We need a mediator, a third party, so we can all sit down and have a > >civilized airing of our collective pasts, work thru the wounds, apologize > >for wrongs, and MOVE FOWARD. Will it ever happen? You can get so busy > >looking over your shoulder at where you've been, you can no longer see > >where it is you are going. History as we here love is a wonderful thing, > >but I see it as a groundwork on which to understand ourselves through our > >pasts, and on which to build for the future. > > > > As for me, to all the black members of this list, don't blame me, and > > don't blame the south, but in whatever way I can apologize for myself and > > my family, I apologize for what my people did to your people. It was > > wrong. I cannot begin to "understand" your experience any more than I can > > "understand" what happened to the Jews in Nazi Germany, since I am not > > Jewish, but don't sell me short [or insult me]. I am still a human being > > and I can be horrified at cruelty done to other human beings. I have > > empathy. > > > > Nancy > > > > ------- > > I was never lost, but I was bewildered once for three days. > > > > --Daniel Boone > > > > > > > > On Jan 19, 2007, at 5:28 AM, Clara Callahan wrote: > > > >> Forced and/or litigated apologies mean nothing. Apologies on behalf of > >> people long dead who cannot speak for themselves mean nothing and are > >> totally ridiculous 300 years on, and those asking for them know it. It > >> would be interesting to know how many times these politically correct > >> public apologies have been publicly accepted by those demanding the > >> apologies. The travesty will be if this gentleman is forced to > >> apologize for not apologizing. The whole thing is bogus and everyone > >> knows it. > >> > >> Excalibur131 <[log in to unmask]> wrote: ----- Original essage ----- > >> From: "John Frederick Fausz" > >> To: > >> Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 2:18 PM > >> Subject: VIRGINIA LEGISLATURE > >> > >> > >> > >>> When the legislature moved back to regular session in Richmond, > >>> however, that warm and cozy feeling quickly vanished. As I read > >>> in the St. Louis Post Dispatch on 1/17, Delegate Frank Harmon > >>> spoke against a "measure that would apologize on the state's > >>> behalf to the descendants of slaves." He allegedly told a > >>> Charlottesville reporter that "our black citizens should get over > >>> slavery" and then added: "are we going to force the Jews to > >>> apologize for killing Christ?" Needless to say, his comments > >>> "drew denunciations from stunned colleagues." > >> > >>> > >>> Fred Fausz > >>> St. Louis > >> > >> > >> In these times of political correctness, I wonder what Delegate Frank > >> Harmon's "stunned colleagues" were whispering behind closed doors? Do > >> you > >> think that, in secrecy, some of his "stunned colleagues" weren't so > >> stunned > >> after all and agreed with what he said in part or in whole? Would they > >> have > >> denounced Delegate Frank Harmon if his words were spoken in private? It > >> is > >> so hard to tell fact from fiction when political correctness is the name > >> of > >> the game. > >> > >> Tom > >> Eastern Shore & More Forum > >> http://www.easternshoremore.com/forum/ > >> > >> To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the > >> instructions > >> at http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html > >> > >> > >> To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the > >> instructions > >> at http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html > > > > To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the instructions > > at http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html > > > > To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the instructions > at http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the instructions at http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html