Friend, Typesetters long ago learned that using all caps for more than a line or two makes reading very difficult. I would suggest you switch to lower case and use a larger font size as I have here. If you have trouble going from lower case to caps, then just use lower case. Also, there are settings on your computer which will allow you to use a larger font to view anything online. If you still have excuses, maybe you need to ask yourself if always being stubborn is really a good trait. As to the "rule" of when to use caps, that came long before the internet, and ---no matter how old you are now-- was solidly in place long before you were born. The reason? When we have a common means of communicating, we can exchange ideas more readily as we don't then get hung up on someone's individual method. Joanne [log in to unmask] wrote: DEAR FRIENDS, FORGIVE AND PLEASE TOLERATE MY "SHOUTING".......WHICH, ACTUALLY, I AM NOT DOING. I AM , VERY SIMPLY, A POOR TYPIST AND HALF-BLIND TO BOOT. DFM P.S. WHO MADE UP THAT RULE, ANYWAY? THE INTERNET IS SO YOUNG MAYBE IT ISN'T TOO LATE TO CHANGE IT. P.P.S. WASHINGTON, EDWARD COLES & JOHN PLEASANTS WERE STILL RACISTS....JUST LIKE TJ AND EVERYONE ELSE OF THEIR DAY. JUST KINDER, GENTLER RACISTS. ----- Original Message ----- From: "qvarizona" To: Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2005 9:26 PM Subject: Re: Fw: "common-sense Jeffersonian conservative principles" > Sometimes I agree with you (Paul Finkelman) and sometimes I don't, but I appreciate someone willing to point out that it's not a good idea to use Caps when writing email --or anything else, for that matter. I don't mind the "shouting" as much as I do the fact that it's doggone hard to read! > > Joanne > > > > > Paul Finkelman wrote: > Dear Ms. Mills: > > I am not sure what makes you think that; I am simply pointing out that > in the age of Jefferson there were many people who were willing to do so > something about slavery and that Jefferson was not one of them; > thousands of Virginians freed their slaves, for example. Jefferson > wasnot one of them. Between 1780 and 1810 the free black population of > Va. grew from about 2,000 to over 30,000. This growth was due to > private manumissions by thousands of individual Virginians, maybe even > some of those in your 13 generations in the Commonwealth. Jefferson > opposed such acts and opposed any measures designed to end slavery; in > 1820 he opposed a bad on slavery in the western territories. > > Racism, as you point out, is a fluid term with a meaning that changes > over time. TJ was the first American to argue for the innate > inferiority of blacks. He did so pretty early -- 1783 -- in Notes on > the State of Virginia; and then he opposed rights for free blacks. > Similiarly, he opposed private manumission and public emancipation. > All of this is pretty well known, and should not surprise anyone, just > as it no longer surprises people that he held his own children in > slavery as well has his half-sister-in-law (Sally Hemings) and his > half-brothers-in-law. This may have made him like many other southern > white men (maybe some of those in your 13 generations) who owned their > own children and enslaved their relatives. But, many Virginians > (again, maybe some of those in your 13 generations) did not act that > way. If you are asking me whether I think Washingon or Edward Coles, or > John Pleasant, of the countless other Virginians who free their slaves > are more admirable than Jefferson, the answer is yes. Were all these > people racial egalitarians according to our social norms. But, were the > more supprtive of racial fairness than most Virginians -- and more so > than TJ -- the answer is clearly yes. > > One moreo thing, if you are going to respoind, please take your "Caps > lock" off the computer, as most of the time when someone writes in all > caps it seems as if the person is yelling on the computer screen. I am > sure as a 13th generation Virginian you don't intend to me yelling at > me, but are rather asking good questions about the nature of history. > (I should add that my son is a first generation Virginian!) > > -- > Paul Finkelman > Chapman Distinguished Professor of Law > University of Tulsa College of Law > 3120 East 4th Place > Tulsa, OK 74104-3189 > > 918-631-3706 (office) > 918-631-2194 (fax) > > [log in to unmask] > > > > [log in to unmask] wrote: > > >MR FINKELMAN, > >SO, YOU'RE SAYING THAT SOME RACISTS WERE BETTER RACISTS THAN OTHER RACISTS? > >DFM > > > > > > > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Paul Finkelman" > > >To: > >Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2005 6:55 PM > >Subject: Re: Fw: "common-sense Jeffersonian conservative principles" > > > > > > > > > >>Dear Ms. Mills: > >> > >>I just posted something along these lines; I guess is has not yet > >>surfaced; in case it got lost in cyberspace, I append it to this message. > >> > >>================= > >> > >>we debate these issues every few years. For a long discussion of how > >>Jefferson helped invent scientific racism, look at the last two chapters > >>of my book, SLAVERY AND THE FOUNDERS: RACE AND LIBERTY IN THE AGE OF > >>JEFFERSON, 2nd ed. 2001. In that book I judge Jefferson by the > >>standards of his own time; compared to many other founders, Jefferson > >>does not fare well. I think Jefferson should be judged the standards of > >>his own time; compare his view on race to those of Washington, Franklin, > >>Hamilton, Adams, as well as his many European friends, or John and Henry > >>Laurens in South Carolina, or LaFayette. > >>As for the Indian removal. I don't have the cite handy but shortly > >>after buying Louisiana he proposed moving Indians out of hte Southeast > >>and shipping them west. > >> > >>TJ may have believed rocks could not fall from the sky, but he could not > >>consuct the experiment. He also believed that the blood of blacks was > >>darker than the blood of whites, that they smelled worse than whites, > >>and that the were incapable of forming loving relationships like whites. > >>Over the course of his adult life he owned more than 400 slaves; and he > >>could certainly have observed many things about them. He sold off more > >>than 80 in a ten year period (contrast this to Washington who never sold > >>a slave or Madison who only sold a few to neighbors late in life when he > >>literally could not afford to maintain them). Surley while selling off > >>these slaves he would have been able to observe how the slaves felt > >>about the destruction of their families. Washington said you do not > >>take men to market like cattle. Jefferson sent scores to market like > >>cattle. I agree, judge him by the standards of his own world. When his > >>neighbor Edward Coles wanted to free his slaves, Jefferson told him not > >>to do it and refused to take a public stand supporting either private > >>manumissions or gradual abolition. When his friend St. George Tucker > >>(the law professor at William and Mary and a judge) proposed a scheme > >>for ending slavery in Va. Jefferson refused to endorse it, or come up > >>with one of his own. > >> > >>Yes, I agree completely. Judge him against the best of his generation. > >> > >> > >>================= > >> > >>[log in to unmask] wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >>>MR FINKELMAN, > >>>I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHO, IN YOUR ILLUSTRIOUS OPINION, MIGHT NOT HAVE > >>> > >>> > >BEEN A "THOROUGH GOING RACIST" OR, FOR THAT MATTER, JUST A PLAIN, LONG, OLD, > >REGULAR RACIST, IN THE 18TH CENTURY WESTERN WORLD. DO YOU SUPPOSE THAT IF > >YOU HAD BEEN ALIVE IN THE 18TH CENTURY, WITHOUT THE BENEFIT OF THE HINDSIGHT > >OF A 21ST CENTURY PERSON, YOU JUST MIGHT POSSIBLY HAVE BEEN A TYPICAL, > >AVERAGE, NORMAL WHITE MAN WHO PRESUMED, LIKE EVERYONE ELSE (EXCEPT THE MAN > >OF COLOR), THAT THE WHITE RACE WAS THE SUPERIOR RACE? > > > > > >>>GIVE ME A BREAK: EVERYONE WAS A THOROUGH GOING RACIST BACK THEN. > >>> > >>> > >EVERYONE! > > > > > >>>DEANE MILLS > >>>13TH GENERATION (PROVEN) VIRGINIAN > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>>Sent: Sunday, December 04, 2005 3:24 PM > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>Re: "common-sense Jeffersonian conservative principles" > >>>he was a thorough going > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>>>racist, who believed that blacks were mentally inferior to whites, and > >>>>>he wanted to remove all Indians to someplace else (like where I live); > >>>>>he invented the Indian removal. > >>>>> > >>>>>Unlike modern conservaitves, he believed in balanced budgets and worked > >>>>>at them; he was a free trader, except when it came to the Embargo > >>>>>against Haiti and then Europe. > >>>>> > >>>>>Unlike moderns conservatives, he believed in a small military and > >>>>>avoided military adventurism whenever possible. > >>>>> > >>>>>And, unlike modern Consrvatives and Republicnas, he did, to his great > >>>>>credit, believe in religious freedom and a strict separation of Church > >>>>>and State. > >>>>> > >>>>>Finally, of course, he believed in racial subordination and slavery. I > >>>>>will refrain from commenting on whether that fits with the > >>>>>administration or Sen. Allen > >>>>> > >>>>>Paul Finkelman > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the > >>>> > >>>> > >instructions > > > > > >>>>at http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the instructions > >>>at http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>-- > >>Paul Finkelman > >>Chapman Distinguished Professor of Law > >>University of Tulsa College of Law > >>3120 East 4th Place > >>Tulsa, OK 74104-3189 > >> > >>918-631-3706 (office) > >>918-631-2194 (fax) > >> > >>[log in to unmask] > >> > >> > >> > >>To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the instructions > >>at http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html > >> > >> > > > >To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the instructions > >at http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html > > > > > > > > To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the instructions > at http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html > > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! 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