But there was a point, I think in the early 1700s, where schooling  
was discouraged, the gentry even said they did not want the lower  
classes to be educated.

Nancy

-------
I was never lost, but I was bewildered once for three days.

--Daniel Boone



On Dec 4, 2008, at 8:24 AM, Harold Gill wrote:

> I'm not so sure that the gentry "tried to keep the 'lower classes'  
> here from becoming literate." Every apprenticeship indenture in  
> Virginia required that the apprentice be taught to read and write  
> and some even specified the number of years schooling the  
> apprentice was to be given. Most poor orphans were apprenticed as  
> well as the children of poor people.
> HBG
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sunshine49" <[log in to unmask]>
> To: <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent: Wednesday, December 03, 2008 10:38 PM
> Subject: Re: [VA-ROOTS] A question re: education........
>
>
>> An exception to this could be immigrants from England, where they  
>> had very good local schools, usually run by churches but  
>> occasionally by  some wealthy local citizen, where children were  
>> taught to read and  write, chiefly so they could read their  
>> Bibles. Virginia aristocracy, unfortunately, actively tried to  
>> keep the "lower classes" here from becoming literate, thinking  
>> that would better keep them content with their station in life.  
>> But many, many English immigrants, even  indentured servants in  
>> the 1600s, could read and write.
>>
>> That's an excellent book, though, and fascinating to read.
>>
>> Nancy
>>
>> -------
>> I was never lost, but I was bewildered once for three days.
>>
>> --Daniel Boone
>>
>>
>>
>> On Dec 3, 2008, at 8:26 PM, Cynthia McDaniel wrote:
>>
>>> According to Albion's Seed by David Hackett Fischer, literacy in  
>>> VA during
>>> the 17th century depended upon your station in life.  Among the   
>>> gentry,
>>> almost 100% were literate.  They educated their children with  
>>> private
>>> tutors.  Below that rank, the figure of literacy declines:
>>>
>>> Status of Father Male  Female
>>> High 100% 100%
>>> High Middle 87 80
>>> Middle 80 17
>>> Lower Middle 44 20
>>> Lower 50(?) 5.3  (I suspect the first figure for males is wrong
>>> since it is higher that the figure for the lower middle  
>>> class...but that's
>>> what Fischer says.)
>>>
>>> According to Fischer, the prevailing attitude of the gentry was   
>>> that it was
>>> "better be never born than ill-bred (i.e., unschooled)" if you  
>>> were  of the
>>> elite class.  However, for other classes, the attitude of the   
>>> gentry was: "I
>>> thank God there are no free schools nor printing...for learning  
>>> has brought
>>> disobedience and heresy, and sects into the world, and printing  
>>> has divulged
>>> them, and libels against the best government.  God keep us from   
>>> both!" This
>>> attitude was in place in England (southeastern part) long before   
>>> slaves were
>>> brought into VA in large quantity.
>>>
>>> Fischer says that the libraries of the gentry sometimes rivaled the
>>> libraries of colleges.  But the yeomanry owned fewer books and   
>>> servants
>>> owned nearly none.
>>>
>>> I think the idea that the first son would be educated the most is  
>>> likely.  I
>>> base this opinion on the research of my own line.  In a  
>>> collateral  line of
>>> mine, the Scarboroughs, Edmund Scarborough and his second son,   
>>> Edmund, came
>>> to VA about 1633.  Edmund I's first son, Charles, was in college  
>>> in London
>>> (Caius College).  Charles (the first son) was christened in Dec   
>>> 1615 in
>>> London, graduated from Caius College in Cambridge in March   
>>> 1633/1634 at
>>> 17/18 and graduated from A.M. of Caius College in 1639.  He was the
>>> physician for King Charles II,  James II and William III.   
>>> Because Edmund II
>>> accompanied his father, it doesn't appear that he went to  
>>> college  (he was
>>> two years younger than Charles).  He may have been self-educated  
>>> after
>>> coming to VA because he advanced in station to Lt. Colonel and   
>>> served as
>>> Speaker of the House of Burgesses, was a merchant with several  
>>> vessels
>>> traveling between Massachusetts, MD, VA and England (and  
>>> possibly  SC). He
>>> was the largest land owner in VA at the time and a fierce   
>>> competitor in
>>> ensuring his self-interest. (He moved the line between MD and VA  
>>> to maintain
>>> his property in VA...the line was changed after vigorous protest  
>>> by  the
>>> Governor of MD.  Nor was he friendly towards  Native Americans  
>>> who referred
>>> to him as the "Conjuror".
>>>
>>> As far as colleges in the Americas, the College of William and  
>>> Mary  was the
>>> second college established in the Americas in 1693 so the gentry   
>>> did not
>>> have to send their sons to England.
>>>
>>>
>>> Cynthia McDaniel
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Research and writing about Virginia genealogy and family   
>>> history.
>>> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of nelhatch
>>> Sent: Wednesday, December 03, 2008 12:03 PM
>>> To: [log in to unmask]
>>> Subject: [VA-ROOTS] A question re: education........
>>>
>>> HATCHER website: http://hatcherfamilyassn.com
>>> HALL DNA project: http://homepages.rootsweb.com/~nhatcher/hall/  
>>> HDNAtest.htm
>>> "If you can't stand the skeletons, stay out of the closet" - Val  
>>> D Greenwood
>>>
>>> I have a question (or two) about the customs in the 1600s  
>>> regarding  the
>>> education of one's sons.
>>>
>>> For a man of above average means, was it the norm to educate  
>>> one's  sons in
>>> England? Or might only the eldest son be given this type of  
>>> education?
>>>
>>> What would the age of a young man have to be to enter college? I   
>>> believe one
>>> would graduate college in that time period at about the age of  
>>> 18?  Is my
>>> thinking correct on this?
>>>
>>> Thanks for any input on this!
>>>
>>> Nel Hatcher
>>>
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>>
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>>
>> -- 
>> No virus found in this incoming message.
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>> Release Date: 12/2/2008 9:31 AM
>>
>

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