Catherine,
Others will be soon coming out with books dealing with this very subject
also. Looks like a great cap to the full 10 years since the
Jefferson-Hemings FIASCO first burst forth to confuse the public and
lead them to believe that TJ fathered slave children. I hope you will
offer the same coverage to these future authors that you afford Mrs.
Gordon-Reed.
May I suggest that you discuss the possibility of a full investigation
into the handling of this important topic with your top management. You
would be doing a great community service to air this controversy fully.
The "he's not guilty group" would be most happy to participate in any
nationally or regionally televised debate on this subject. In fact, the
Annette Gordon-Reed broadcast would be a good time for this to be
included. You may know that AGR completely gave a 180 degree account of
a letter from TJ's granddaughter, Ellen Randolph Coolidge, to her
husband, completely changing the meaning of the subject. She did state
in her book that DNA did NOT prove that the Eston Hemings descendant was
a descendant of TJ. Let us see what her new book will have to say
regarding TJ's legacy..........I have a copy on order and will read
every word.
The Hemings family refusal to gather further DNA from a son of Madison
Hemings would make a good topic for Annette to cover.......will she?
Will she tell us about Dr. Foster's selection of a known male Eston
descendant, John Weeks Jefferson, and the fact that his family had
ALWAYS claimed descent from "a Jefferson uncle", meaning Randolph
Jefferson, younger TJ brother. SURE there would be a match, and there
was, if we are to believe the Eston family oral history, BUT
TJ.........NO! DNA does not consider given names. The test only proved
that the Eston oral history was correct..........no more no less. Eston
never claimed descent from Thomas Jefferson that Madison Hemings did.
Further, will she tell us that Madison Hemings claim in the Pike Co.,
Ohio newspaper, is an UNPROVED statement that Dolley Madison named him
on the date of his birth at Monticello on Jan. 19.1805. Research
indicates that the Madisons NEVER visited Va. from Washington during
winter. Just emagine, if you will, that Dolley, supporting her husband
as Secretary of State and Mr. Jefferson as his White House Hostess
At the beginning of a busy second term, announces that she must rush
through the dangerous mid-winter on a four day hazardous journey, to the
bedside of a slave who is to have "A MALE" birth of which she would like
to name for her husband. This was long before we could predict the sex
of a child prior to birth and what if it would have been a female? Ha,
ha, you get the point! To "slam" the white people of the time Madison
says that Sally was promised a nice gift which was not given, BUT thatb
was the procedure that white people did. The abolitionist reporter
Samuel Wetmore was "cock sure" that no one of that time could REFUTE
that preposterous claim, but modern researchers have more advanced tools
at hand. The opposition paper, The Waverly Watchman, six days later,
completely tore apart this newspaper claim in a scornful retort.
Herb Barger
Jefferson Family Historian
Asst. to Dr. Foster with the Jefferson-Hemings DNA Study
-----Original Message-----
From: Discussion of research and writing about Virginia history
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Catherine Moore
Sent: Thursday, July 17, 2008 2:25 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [VA-HIST] Mr. Jefferson's Women
Dear List,
Watching this discussion unfold, I hope that you all will tune in to
BackStory's interview with Annette Gordon-Reed, who has just finished a
new book on this subject: The Hemingses of Monticello--An American
Family (not yet released). She has some very interesting things to say
about why this debate is still so interesting to Americans. She is a
guest on our history of interracial mixing show, which will air in
Virginia on July 26th (WMRA) and 27th (Radio IQ). Out-of-staters will be
able to listen to the show online by audio stream or podcast at
www.backstoryradio.org. "BackStory With the American History Guys" is a
new public radio show that brings historical perspective to the events
happening around us every day.
Catherine Moore
Research/Production Assistant
BackStory, VFH Radio
Charlottesville, VA
434-924-4403
[log in to unmask] wrote:
> I think the point is the exact opposite. Why are academic types
> insistent
> on proving that a founding father had sex with some Black female. I
think the
> interracial sex aspect must titillate you all.
>
>
> In a message dated 7/17/2008 9:24:08 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
> [log in to unmask] writes:
>
> Ins't Herb's "theory" simply that it was anyone but Jefferson? The
> logic
> escapes me.
>
> Jefferson was a man with normal, even high level, sex drive. As young
> man he
> propositioned his neighbor's wife; his own wife was constantly
pregnant.
> When she died Sally was soon available. Sally was his wife's
half-sister and
> probably looked somewhat (much) like his late wife. Jefferson lived
in a
> culture where slaveowning men had free and easy access to their slave
women.
> Elite slaveowners, like Jefferson, lived in a culture where sex with
slaves was
> common and unexceptional. As a widower Jefferson was not even
subject to
> raise eyebrows for cheating on his wfe. While some modern scholars
are shocked
> at the olded Jefferson having a relationship with the teenaged Sally,
this
> was not shocking at the time. Madison was courting a girl in her
early teens
> when he was in his late 20s or early 30s and no one thought anything
of it.
> President Tyler married a much much younger woman after his first
wife died.
> This was not uncommon. Nor were most of the Founders "prudes" or
> "Victorians" about sex (John Adams and perhaps John Jay are notable
exceptions).
>
> So, the real issue is why are people like Herb so invested in
> asserting that
> TJ could not, would not, did not, have sex with Sally, when all the
evidence
> (timing of her the birth of her children, access, etc.) was there
before the
> DNA came along? Why would we expect anything else from a
slaveholding
> widower isolated on his mountain top? Do we think Jefferson in his
40s became a
> monk?
>
>
>
> Paul Finkelman
> President William McKinley Distinguished Professor of Law and Public
> Policy Albany Law School
> 80 New Scotland Avenue
> Albany, New York 12208-3494
>
> 518-445-3386
> [log in to unmask]
>
>>>> Henry Wiencek <[log in to unmask]> 07/17/08 9:05 AM >>>
>>>>
> Unless I am mistaken, Herb's theory (and this is a new theory) that
> the French servant Adrien Petit fathered children with Sally Hemings
> at Monticello does not hold water. Adrien Petit worked for Jefferson
> in Philadelphia and he returned to France in January 1794, a year
> before Sally Hemings conceived Harriet 1, who was born in October
> 1795. Petit was across the sea when Hemings conceived children at
> Monticello. If there is a record that states otherwise I will be glad
> to see it.
>
> Henry Wiencek
>
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