Herb,
I am sure that anytime a tv station takes footage that it is submitted to an
editorial staff, and slices of film hit the floor. I'm sure you are neither
the first nor the last person who was interviewed for a broadcast and never
saw themselves appear in the final show. Having read your interview in
Lanier's book and comparing it to the other interviews in the book, your
lacks any sense of humility or consideration for other points of view. If in
the PBS interview you referred to people you never met or knew, as LIARS, as
you do on this list, it is likely that the editors at PBS may have
considered your interview as an invitation to a trouble. If they were intent
on a factual presentation, and if your are in person as illmannered and
cocksure of your "truth" as superior to the "truth" of other researchers,
your interview with them was probably a disappointment.
In any event, it seems that the PBS site includes the Primary Sources that
teachers have a hard time presenting for students in a usable fasion.
Certainly, it would have been better had the reporter been able to sound
record both Madison Hemings and Isaac Jefferson, but that technology was not
yet available.
Anne
Anne Pemberton
[log in to unmask]
http://www.erols.com/apembert
http://www.educationalsynthesis.org
----- Original Message -----
From: "Herbert Barger" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2008 6:52 PM
Subject: Re: Jefferson's Overseer No proof that the Pike Co. article is
believable
> This is the PBS web page about the TJ/Hemings study and some are very
> good. This is also the PBS Frontline that interviewed me for their Sally
> Hemings Special and did not allow the public to see a frame of it.
>
> I have no knowledge of his being discredited. He was a Pulitzer Prize
> author and the book has nothing but praise for his work. Wash Post says,
> "The story of widower Jefferson taking a slave concubine is unproved and
> improvable." None other that TJ's very knowledgeable biographer, Dumas
> Malone (6 vols on TJ), states, "Virginius Dabney's book is a convincing
> response.....should appeal to any fair-minded reader."
>
> Another excellent book I would recommend to get an insight to her work
> is: "Fawn Brodie, A Biographer's Life" by Newell G. Bringhurst.
>
> Herb
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Discussion of research and writing about Virginia history
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Anne Pemberton
> Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2008 4:15 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [VA-HIST] Jefferson's Overseer No proof that the Pike Co.
> article is believable
>
> Herb,
>
> Before I found this link:
> http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/jefferson/cron/1873march.h
> tml
>
> I was resigned to having to buy the book by Dabney, even tho something
> sticks in the back of my head that he's been discredited on his writings
> (In
> the years of his editorship in Richmond, I was living in Richmond.)
>
> Now, that I have the Memoir, exactly what, other than the Dolly story,
> is
> known to be non-factual?
>
> I also looked up Madison Hemings on Wikipedia and the controversy is
> nicely
> noted in the entry. In that article, it says that the Memoirs were
> collabored by statement from other Monticello slaves.
> The other slaves said that the relationship between TJ and Sally was
> well
> known on the plantation.
>
> From the little bit of effort this afternoon, it would seem that the
> folks
> doing the research at Monticello had more to go on than merely the
> newspaper
> report and the cencus entry.
>
> Now, to wait for the Dabney book to arrive and see how he picks apart
> Madison's revelation.
>
> Anne
>
>
>
> Anne Pemberton
> [log in to unmask]
> http://www.erols.com/apembert
> http://www.educationalsynthesis.org
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Herbert Barger" <[log in to unmask]>
> To: <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2008 2:54 PM
> Subject: Re: Jefferson's Overseer No proof that the Pike Co. article is
> believable
>
>
>> The reason I keep mentioning the Wetmore/Madison article is because it
>> was a major "roadmap" used by the Monticello Study Group and if it was
>> incorrect it would be misleading to researchers. For convenience I
>> invite you to get a copy of The Jefferson Scandals, A Rebuttal by
>> Virginius Dabney.
>>
>> Herb
>>
>>
>>
>> Herbert,
>>
>> After I get going on my new category for Famous Americans on the
>> Founding
>> Fathers, I will look up the article on Madison Hemings that you keep
>> mentioning. If you have a link to the article, it would be great of
> you
>> to
>> share it and save me a search.
>>
>> Most folks have heard stories in their families about things that
>> happened
>> at their birth. Last spring, my niece had a little girl, and when I
> saw
>> the
>> tiny bundle the next day, she gave me a very pretty smile. A year
> later,
>> she
>> is still quite the smiler. When she is grown, I will tell her that she
>> smiled at me before she was a day old. When she learns that babies do
>> not
>> have real smiles until they are older, she may discount what I tell
> her.
>> So
>> be it. I till tell her anyway!
>>
>> I tell a nephew, who is now in the throes of adolescence, that he sent
>> his
>> first email when he was six weeks old, and his mother insists he was
>> older.
>> He will certainly not remember if it was a six weeks or thirteen
> weeks,
>> and
>> it's probably immaterial which memory is right. But the fact is that,
>> gas
>> notwithstanding, Lilly gave me a pretty smiles, and no matter how many
>> weeks, Taylor came to the Internet in his infancy. I would have for
>> someone
>> to hang either of these young folks for repeating one or the other
> side
>> of
>> these stories and be misjudged for repeating what they have or will
> have
>>
>> heard over and over growing up.
>>
>> The same applies to Madison's statement of Dolley naming him. Maybe it
>> was
>> Dolley herself who told the pretty young boy that she had been there
> at
>> his
>> birth. And, maybe indeed she misremembered which of Sally's children
> she
>> was
>> there to name. We do not know where the mistake came from, we only
> know
>> that
>> a mistake was made, and it wasn't by either Madison Hemings, nor,
>> likely, by
>> the man who wrote the newspaper article. To classify either one a liar
>> or to
>> discredit the rest of the article without appropriate study, is to
> fail
>> to
>> understand the meaning of TRUTH and LIES as well as the humanity of
>> humanity.
>>
>> Anne
>>
>> Anne Pemberton
>> [log in to unmask]
>> http://www.erols.com/apembert
>> http://www.educationalsynthesis.org
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Herbert Barger" <[log in to unmask]>
>> To: <[log in to unmask]>
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2008 1:42 PM
>> Subject: Re: Jefferson's Overseer No proof that the Pike Co. article
> is
>> believable
>>
>>
>>> The "misstatement" made by Wetmore/Madison about his naming is just
>> one
>>> of several doubtful remarks made in this article. If this one
>> statement
>>> is wrong....how are we to be expected to believe any of it?
>>>
>>> Herb
>>>
>>>
>>> Herb,
>>>
>>> I would like to read all those articles you cite, but I'm not sure
>> where
>>> to
>>> find them. I will not guarantee that my reading them will lead me to
>> the
>>>
>>> conclusions you came from. I do not feel the statement on who was
>> there
>>> at
>>> his birth and named him is material enough to negate anything else in
>>> the
>>> article.
>>>
>>> From the picture in Lanier's book, it seems that the entry was made
> in
>>> the
>>> same handwriting as the list of names. Certainly scientific tests can
>>> confirm that both the handwriting and the ink were there on the
>> original
>>>
>>> signed by the official at the top of the page. Census records are
>>> valuable
>>> evidence of when and where people lived and what offspring they had.
>> If
>>> they
>>> were typically subject to changes made by unauthorized persons, I
>> would
>>> imagine they could not be useful in typical geneological research,
> yet
>>> they
>>> are, in the absence of family bibles or actual birth and death
>>> certificates.
>>>
>>> Well, I'm a gonna hit the hay, and we'll pick this up some more
>>> tomorrow.
>>>
>>> Anne
>>>
>>> Anne Pemberton
>>> [log in to unmask]
>>> http://www.erols.com/apembert
>>> http://www.educationalsynthesis.org
>>>
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