Maitland--
It is of course possible to play dueling citations all day long. For
contrast, take a look at the scholarship of Harry Jaffa on Lincoln.
Professor Gutzman has much interesting and thoughtful to say about Jaffa,
and I look forward to his work reaching fruition. But until that hits
press, I take Jaffa to set a high standard in principled defense of
Lincoln's constitutionalism. If you wish to demolish Lincoln, it seems to
me that it is incumbant on you to show why the *best* arguments of his most
thoughtful defenders are incorrect.
Best,
Kevin
--On Thursday, March 06, 2003 2:23 AM -0800 Maitland Westbrook
<[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> Anne,
>
> Have you read the book "Forced Into Glory:Abraham Lincoln's White Dream",
> 2000 (had three printings in one year), by Lerone Bennett, Jr; or "Lincoln
> The Man" 1931, by Egar Lee Masters? And Mr has his own book, "The Real
> Lincoln: A New Look at Abraham Lincoln, His Agenda, and an Unnecessary
> War". I've only just started to read this one.
>
> Mr Bennett's book is an eye opener; Mr Masters' book was bought by the
> case and destroyed by Lincoln supporters. Both are well supported by
> documentation.
>
> I won't bore you with my thoughts of Lincoln, as I do not think he was a
> great president, just a great politician. Mr. Master's book goes a good
> deal in his early life and his entry into politics and his connections
> with big business (ie, the railroads).
>
> I too find that the Liberatarian values are bit off the scale, but I find
> myself agreeing in about 75% of the time. However, his writings on the
> WBTS and Lincoln are thought provoking.
>
> Thank you for the good luck. I've moved here to get married (May 31). It
> is a bit different from the US, but am having a great time. My finacee's
> family is wonderful, actually, everyone is so nice - I may not come back!!
> Well,,will have to come back, have to be buried in good ole Virginia
> soil. :>D
>
> Maitland
>
> --- Anne Pemberton <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> Maitland,
>>
>> Thanks for the link. I explore it this morning and a bit more
>> this
>> afternoon. I seems to be more of an "opinion" site than an informational
>> site. Many of the "frauds" he sites happened in other elections and
>> after
>> Lincoln's death. The admission of new states is clearly not an "election
>> fraud", tho, if substantiated by hard facts, the posting of army
>> soldiers
>> at polling places would be fraud. I'm undecided about the furlough
>> policy
>> since it favored but did not exclude. A great deal of discretion was
>> granted the US Army Officers. Was it an official act of the Commander in
>> Chief, or was it something less?
>>
>> As to the opinion of the author, he has an interesting Journal
>> on
>> his site which explained where he was coming from. The Journal for
>> Liberatarian Studies seems to be one of his projects. I learned long ago
>> that Liberatarian values and my values are at odds. I've read their
>> publications regarding education and know their facts are skewed and
>> taken
>> out of context.
>>
>> Good luck on your move. It's been a long time now since I've
>> had
>> to do it, but there were times in my life when I felt like I lived out
>> of
>> carton boxes!
>>
>> I look forward to other sources and you get around to it. I'm
>> not
>> teaching the civil war, but will be teaching Lincoln. My current
>> emphasis
>> is on the sadness of his life which didn't prevent his greatness.
>>
>> Anne
>>
>> At 02:11 AM 3/5/03 -0800, Maitland Westbrook wrote:
>> > Anne:
>> >
>> > I did a quick search under 'election 1864 fraud' and came up with many
>> > sites citing the fraud involved in the election. This insert comes
>> from
>> > http://www.mises.org/fullarticle.asp?record=554&month=26
>> >
>> > Hope this helps for now..and when I find a site that offers a better
>> > examination of the elections, I'll forward it to you.
>> >
>> > Maitland
>> >
>> >
>> > --- Anne Pemberton <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> > > Maitland,
>> > >
>> > > Can you recommend a better site?
>> > >
>> > > Actually, the site opens with remarks about the fact that
>> the
>> > > nation at war, and divided in the war, held an orderly election. The
>> > > site
>> > > says that the election occurred with "relatively little corruption".
>> In
>> > > looking at the scope and purpose of the overall site, it perhaps
>> > > suggests
>> > > that whatever "fraud" took place was not as significant as in other
>> > > elections ????
>> > >
>> > > I think Lincoln was realistic. He was not the picture of a
>> > > president, and did not subscribe to the "polite" conventions of the
>> "PC"
>> > > folks of his time. To paraphrase Davey Crockett (or his spin
>> doctors),
>> > > "he
>> > > was sure he was right, then went ahead." It took some courage to
>> agree
>> > > to
>> > > his nomination before Sherman did in Atlanta, but he had that
>> courage,
>> > > and
>> > > it paid off.
>> > >
>> > > Unless you know of better sites, I'll probably add this
>> link to
>> > > my
>> > > student link pages. It's a useful source for students and teachers
>> > > seeking
>> > > information on the presidential elections, even if it has
>> inadequacies
>> > > for
>> > > history majors.
>> > >
>> > > Anne
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > At 07:30 AM 3/4/03 -0800, you wrote:
>> > > > The site refered to is a softshoe approach to the election of '84.
>> It
>> > > > doesn't cover the fraud, etc in the elections and under plays the
>> role
>> > > of
>> > > > Sherman's actions in the Southeast. This site is designed to
>> preach to
>> > > > the choir and the PC minded of today and glosses over the full
>> impact
>> > > of
>> > > > the election, most noteworthy due to the fact that for the first
>> time a
>> > > > country at war actually held elections, and the great amount of
>> fraud
>> > > that
>> > > > took place.
>> > > >
>> > > > Even Lincoln thought he would lose and only felt good about the
>> > > election
>> > > > after Atlanta fell.
>> > > >
>> > > > M. Westbrook
>> > > >
>> > > > --- Anne Pemberton <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> > > > > war expectations for the south than Lincoln did. Check out
>> > > > > http://elections.harpweek.com/4Overview/overview-1864-1.htm and
>> > > other
>> > > > > sites
>> > >
>> > > Anne Pemberton
>> > > [log in to unmask]
>> > >
>> > > http://www.erols.com/stevepem
>> > > http://www.educationalsynthesis.org
>> > >
>> > > To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the
>> > > instructions
>> > > at http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > __________________________________________________
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>>
>> Anne Pemberton
>> [log in to unmask]
>>
>> http://www.erols.com/stevepem
>> http://www.educationalsynthesis.org
>>
>> To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the
>> instructions
>> at http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html
>
>
> __________________________________________________
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--
Kevin R. Hardwick, Ph.D.
Assistant Professor
Department of History, MSC 2001
James Madison University
Harrisonburg VA 22807
Phone: 540/568-6306
Email: [log in to unmask]
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