J. Martin notes, and I largely agree with him, that "virtually no one cares who sired [Hemings'] children." That said, its quite evident that large numbers of slave owning men (or men who worked for them or were in their household) did in fact sire children by their female slaves. I don't think this should surprise any one, given the power relations embedded in slavery. But its astounding that until fairly recently, and despite the contemporary best efforts of the Grimke sisters, this fact has largely been neglected in histories of slavery.
All best,
Kevin
---- Original message ----
>Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 17:52:04 -0500
>From: Dick Martin <[log in to unmask]>
>Subject: Re: A modest proposal re the DNA debate
>To: [log in to unmask]
>
>T think everyone is missing the point here. Virtually no one cares who sired these children! Is that going to change anything? This site would be best served if all of the Jefferson historians and nosey others would carry on their conversations in private and not through this venue. I personally am tired of deleting numerous messages while a few of you argue the parentage of a person's children which you are not even related to. Please discontinue this line of discussion and move on to something that is important to the general population, not the few learned? Individuals.
>J. Martin
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Discussion of research and writing about Virginia history [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of JEFFREY D SOUTHMAYD
>Sent: Friday, February 27, 2009 11:58 AM
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: Re: A modest proposal re the DNA debate
>
> Don't know what his previous publications about pottery and architecture have to do with this either.
>
>J South
>
>
>
>You are indeed missing the most fundamental point of all: Professor
>Neiman does not engage the DNA evidence. Instead, he engages the
>apparent coincidences between Sally Hemings's conceptions and TJ's
>sporadic presences at Monticello. He professes to have used statistical
>science to prove that the coincidences prove that TJ fathered six
>Hemings children.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>JDS
>
>
>
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Steven T. Corneliussen <[log in to unmask]>
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Sent: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 11:53 am
>Subject: Re: A modest proposal re the DNA debate
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Don't know what any of this research and writing
>
> > has to do with expertise in dna analysis, but perhaps
>
> > I am missing something.
>
>
>You are indeed missing the most fundamental point of all: Professor
>Neiman does not engage the DNA evidence. Instead, he engages the
>apparent coincidences between Sally Hemings's conceptions and TJ's
>sporadic presences at Monticello. He professes to have used statistical
>science to prove that the coincidences prove that TJ fathered six
>Hemings children.
>
>
>The DNA evidence does figure into the Neiman study, but only insofar as
>the nonstatistical threads of the pro-paternity argument are -- or so
>Dr. Neiman says, anyway -- germane in his application of something
>called Bayes's theorem. He applies that to the=2
>0results of the computer
>simulations with which he started his study.
>
>
>In this matter, Dr. Neiman was working as a scientist, precisely in
>order to invoke science's special authority within a humanities debate.
>But his scientific report "Coincidence or Causal Connection? The
>Relationship between Thomas Jefferson’s Visits to Monticello and Sally
>Hemings’s Conceptions” appeared in a leading humanities journal,
>sequestered from the scrutiny of other scientists.
>
>
>Professor Neiman is a distinguished scholar, and statistical science is
>an important tool for him and his colleagues. See for example the
>description from his Web site for the course "Analytical Methods in
>Archaeology" (http://people.virginia.edu/~fn9r/anth588/index.html).
>Excerpt: "This course examines quantitative analytical techniques used
>in archaeology. Topics include, regression, smoothing, correlation,
>measures of diversity and distance, spatial autocorrelation and Mantel
>methods, seriation, ordination, and clustering."
>
>
>So there's no mystery about his qualifications. In his dual roles at
>U.Va. and Monticello, he's obviously superbly qualified. The mystery, in
>my view since 2000 when this all started, is what caused him to become
>so supremely confident that he could actually use statistical science to
>resolve a two-century-old sex mystery for which the evidence is so
>fragmentary anyhow.
>
>
>Steven T. (Steve) Corneliussen
>
>Poquoson, Virginia
>
>
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Kevin R. Hardwick, Ph.D.
Department of History
James Madison University
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