Jim,
You are right on the facts, but what I had attempted to argue was
that the powers claimed by Parliament (and the English courts),
were precisely the powers claimed by US nationalists in the
antebellum period and fought by pro-slavery, states' rights political
thinkers from the South. Thus, the bullet dodged by slaveholder in
1776, struck in the 1860s.
Harold
Date sent: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 14:14:30 -0400
From: James Hershman <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Teaching Slaves to Read
To: [log in to unmask]
Send reply to: Discussion of research and writing about Virginia history
<[log in to unmask]>
Organization: Georgetown University
> Not so sure the British Parliament was inclined to the abolition of
> slavery in the 1760s and 1770s. After all, it blocked an attempt by
> Virginia's colonial legislature to block the importation of slaves into
> the colony in the 1760s (TJ tried to note that fact in The Declaration).
> Slavery was ended in Britain by a 1773 court case, not an act of
> Parliament. But certainly by the 1830s and 1840s the planters were
> concerned that the British would get the Texas territory and close it off
> to slaveholders.
>
> Jim Hershman
>
> "Harold S. Forsythe" wrote:
>
> > Paul and All,
> >
> > I think Paul is correct on this. The very power of Parliament to
> > repeal all acts supporting slavery, both acts of Parliament and acts of
> > colonial agencies (legislatures?), was the great fear of the plantocracy
> > in the 18th century; a fear reduxed in the controversy over the
> > commerce clause in the era of Gibbons v. Ogden in the 1820s, and upon
> > "black Republican" Lincoln's election to the Presidency.
> >
> > Date sent: Mon, 06 Aug 2001 08:30:15 -0500
> > From: [log in to unmask]
> > Subject: Re: Teaching Slaves to Read
> > To: [log in to unmask]
> > Send reply to: Discussion of research and writing about
> > Virginia history
> > <[log in to unmask]>
> >
> > > I am late coming to this discussion, and have been out of the office
> > > for a while, but it seems to me you could make a strong argument that
> > > from the perspective of slaves, the wrong side one the REvolution and
> > > that freedom would have come earlier (1830s) and easier if the British
> > > had retained the colonies. THis assumes all other historical events,
> > > including imperial emancipation happen as they did.
> > I remember Gary Nash giving a lecture on the Revolution during the
> > Bicentennial. He
> > said that blacks and Native Americans opposed the Revolution for
> > revolutionary reasons. This, a rather nice summary of the idea that a
> > British victory over the "settlers," meant greater freedom and
> > opportunity for the "natives."
> >
> > >
> > > Paul Finkelman
> > > Univ. of Tulsa College of Law
> > >
> > > Quoting "Harold S. Forsythe" <[log in to unmask]>:
> > >
> > > > I find Kevin Phillips to be the only contemporary political
> > > > journalist/commentator
> > > > who seems to know or care much about history. I do not always agree
> > > > with him, and certainly he is no archival scholar, but he seems
> > > > quite well read.
> > > > To the point of American independence being good for slavery:
> > > > CERTAINLY! In 1772 Lord Mansfield in Somerset's Case, ruled
> > > > that slavery must be supported by positive legislation, because the
> > > > status was not supported in common law (here I am summarizing from
> > > > memory.) Given that Parliament at that very moment was involved in
> > > > a contentious controversy with the Colonies about which legislature,
> > > > Commons and Lords, or say the House of Burgesses, had real
> > > > legislative authority in Virginia, the move toward independence
> > > > clearly put authority over slavery into the hands of the Gov't of
> > > > Virginia, not in London.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Date sent: Thu, 02 Aug 2001 11:08:10 -0400
> > > > From: Deane <[log in to unmask]>
> > > > Subject: Re: Teaching Slaves to Read
> > > > To: [log in to unmask]
> > > > Send reply to: Discussion of research and writing about
> > > > Virginia history
> > > > <[log in to unmask]>
> > > >
> > > > > With all due respect, Kevin Phillips does not and never has
> > > > > impressed
> > > > me
> > > > > as much of an historian. He is more of a 'retrospective
> > > > > speculator'.
> > > > It is
> > > > > difficult for me to take his thoughts and ideas too seriously.
> > > > Sincerely,
> > > > > Deane Mills York County Virginia Subject: Re: Teaching Slaves to
> > > > > Read
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > A related question comes to mind: To what extent did
> > > > > > the American
> > > > > > Revolution "liberate" the American colonies from Britain's
> > > > increasing
> > > > > > anti-slavery measures and perhaps contribute to the
> > > > > > establishment
> > > > of
> > > > > > more stringent slavery regulations in the American South, of
> > > > > > which restrictions on education are just one? In his recent
> > > > > > book, "The Cousins' Wars", Kevin Phillips seems to suggest that
> > > > > > was the case.
> > > > > > :-) Bob Shriner
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >From: Loretta Kelldorf <[log in to unmask]>
> > > > > > >Subject: Re: Teaching Slaves To Read
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >Would there be a distinct difference in those laws affecting
> > > > > > >the
> > > > =
> > > > > > >education of Negroes before 1831 and those laws beginning in
> > > > > > >1831
> > > > and
> > > > > > >= later? I am thinking of the Nathaniel Turner massacre in
> > > > Southampton
> > > > > > >VA
> > > > > =
> > > > > > > was in 1831, which event contributed to changed attitudes and
> > > > > > > laws
> > > > =
> > > > > > >affecting the black people.=20
> > > > > >
> > > > > > To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the
> > > > > > instructions at http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html
> > > > >
> > > > > To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the
> > > > instructions
> > > > > at http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Harold S. Forsythe
> > > > Assistant Professor History
> > > > Director: Black Studies
> > > > Fairfield University
> > > > Fairfield, CT 06430-5195
> > > > (203) 254-4000 x2379
> > > >
> > > > To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the
> > > > instructions
> > > > at http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html
> > > >
> > >
> > > To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the
> > > instructions at http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html
> >
> > Harold S. Forsythe
> > Assistant Professor History
> > Director: Black Studies
> > Fairfield University
> > Fairfield, CT 06430-5195
> > (203) 254-4000 x2379
> >
> > To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the
> > instructions at http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html
>
> To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the instructions
> at http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html
Harold S. Forsythe
Assistant Professor History
Director: Black Studies
Fairfield University
Fairfield, CT 06430-5195
(203) 254-4000 x2379
To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the instructions
at http://listlva.lib.va.us/archives/va-hist.html
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