On Jun 26, 2007, at 2:38 PM, Anita Wills wrote:

> I have a hard time envisioning how those who espouse hate today,  
> influenced those in the past. I mean that would be quite a feat  
> wouldn't it?
If you ever find the answer to that one, we'd all like to know.  
Sounds like a neat proposition for Science Fiction but I would have  
trouble conceptualizing the nuts and bolts of it, much less the  
consequences, both intended and unintended.

> I would argue the opposite, that some of those with hate speech  
> take their cue from events of the past.
And so would everyone else on this list. Where on earth that came  
from, I have no idea, but it surely is not something anyone on this  
list has put forth.

> Free Speech is one thing, but when people (usually someone  
> deranged), acts on that speech, you can be held liable. This is  
> what happened with a young man was lynched (I believe in the  
> 1970's), and his mother sued the KKK (I believe it was in Alabama).  
> Also there was a case of an Ethopian, who was beat to death with a  
> bat in Washington State, by a skinhead.  I believe his family also  
> sued the KKK.
The Southern Poverty Law Center with Morris Dees used the legal  
system to eviscerate the finances of the KKK and effectively reduced  
them to ashes. The SPLC wasn't founded until 1971. So using existing  
law plus newly enacted federal legislation on Civil Rights that  
successfully fought jury nullification (As in 12 white goobers  
finding the 13th innocent of murder despite overwhelming evidence;  
and another jury finding OJ innocent of two murders), they were able  
to bring justice where it was formerly a mockery.
>
> The difference between recent events, and history , is that there  
> are laws in place now. There were no laws, or ineffective laws to  
> deal with the lynchings of the past.
The presence of laws is moot without the will to make them work. It  
has starting with English law in 1607, always been against the law to  
commit murder, yet lynchings were, for the thousandth time, extra- 
legal. This list has explained at some length the probable mechanisms  
by which those who disagreed were effectively silenced.

> This topic is about historical events, and not recent events, and  
> that is the point I attempted to make to Lylye. However, there are  
> those on the list who have objectives other than History.
Nah, we just have a wider view than folks with a more railroad like  
view where nothing deviates. Try it, you might find it's useful and  
enjoyable.

Lyle


>
> Anita
>
>
>> From: qvarizona <[log in to unmask]>
>> Reply-To: Discussion of research and writing about Virginia  
>> history              <[log in to unmask]>
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: The Law & Lynching
>> Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2007 08:56:24 -0700
>>
>> Anita,
>>
>> Do you think the Commonwealth of Virginia ever existed in a vacuum?
>>
>> --Joanne
>>
>>
>>
>> Anita Wills <[log in to unmask]> wrote: I see a problem with the  
>> logic here. We are talking about Virginia history,
>> and you continue to bring in events that happened in the recent  
>> past. If you
>> stick to the topic, you may get some helpful responses.
>>
>> Anita
>> >From: "Lyle E. Browning"
>> >Reply-To: Discussion of research and writing about Virginia history
>> >
>> >To: [log in to unmask]
>> >Subject: Re: The Law & Lynching
>> >Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2007 11:08:57 -0400
>> >
>> >By your logic, then only German and Austrian Nazis qualify? None  
>> of  the
>> >other nationalities? No Nazis who moved to South America? No neo-  
>> Nazi
>> >skinheads, White Aryan Nation types, of the more recent   
>> mutations, etc.
>> >etc. etc.?
>> >
>> >I do not ascribe to the hyper-relativist argument as it only  
>> leads to  the
>> >bad guys proliferating. Once again, Hitler was an insignificant   
>> small
>> >group of 1 who metastasized into the full-blown horror.  Likewise  
>> the
>> >growth of Islamic extremists or you name the group  starts with a  
>> few and
>> >grows into the many.
>> >
>> >My view on them is quite simple. Stomp the hell out of all of them,
>> >regardless of origin.
>> >
>> >If that is still incomprehensible to you, we agree to disagree,  
>> with  my
>> >sympathies.
>> >
>> >Lyle Browning, RPA
>> >
>> >
>> >On Jun 25, 2007, at 11:31 PM, Anne Pemberton wrote:
>> >
>> >>Lyle,
>> >>
>> >>Your last response reminds of the old "one drop rule" whereby if a
>> >>person's heritage include "one drop" of non-white blood, they were
>> >>"demoted" to the discriminated-against group.
>> >>
>> >>Why does it bother you so much that a handful of African- 
>> American  MAY be
>> >>racists when there are still so many white-Americans who  still  
>> boldly
>> >>express their racism. If one racist is one too many,  it seems  
>> you should
>> >>focus your scolding on the largest groups,  rather than the
>> >>insignificantly small group.
>> >>
>> >>Let's clean up our own boots before we point to the mud on our   
>> neighbor's
>> >>boots.
>> >>
>> >>Anne
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>Anne Pemberton
>> >>[log in to unmask]
>> >>http://www.erols.com/apembert
>> >>http://www.educationalsynthesis.org
>>
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