Anne,
Since you have Kukla's book in hand, look in the index and find the
name, Randolph Jefferson, WHAT.... it isn't there.... not even the fact
that TJ invited him to Monticello EXACTLY 9 months prior to Eston's
birth. Now back to pg. 136, another reference to Sally's having
conceived Eston late in Aug. 1807, WHY no reference to Randolph? Ever
wonder why he would move to Wisconsin, pass as white and change his name
to what...Jefferson? That would surely draw NO questions!
On pg. 137 Jon tells us that "before his liaison with Sally Hemings,
etc. and following along to "any children Jefferson fathered with Sally
Hemings would legally be white." Now there is a self explanatory
statement of law and science, HOWEVER, where is Mr. Kukla's proof that
TJ EVER fathered a slave child. Again on the same page he informs the
reader that "Jefferson's children by Sally Hemings as well as Mary
Hemings children by Thomas Bell, etc." Are you aware that this Mary and
several slave women were also rumored to have had Thomas Jefferson for
their children....sounds like some recent claims of fathering by many
modern day fathers doesn't it? Famous names draw lots of "wantabes" and
ESPECIALLY if the claim is made AFTER TJ's death.
To further deny the reader of factual research Mr. Kukla again (unless
my tired eyes have overlooked it) has conveniently "overlooked" the most
important full review of the Jefferson-Hemings controversy, we find NO
reference to the findings of the 13 member senior blue ribbon panel of
Jefferson expert researchers and the Scholars Commission Report
(www.tjheritage.org). Any person in the study of history will
immediately recognize these TOP scholars. A great and famous historian
surely would not overlook this would he? Sounds a bit like what Prof.
Joseph Ellis told me, even before the Boston Globe exposed him as a liar
(not my word), about his non-Vietnam and other personal lies they said.
Ellis told me he didn't know that Thomas Jefferson had a brother,
Randolph.....hmmmm, are we then asked to believe some of the recent
books they are publishing. Sure does look like some sort of conspiracy
and great agenda, in my opinion. On pg.4 you will note that Jon Kukla is
"careful" to state that DNA had confirmed a genetic relationship between
"THOMAS JEFFERSON'S FAMILY" (a slight difference I read here, and ONE of
Sally's children.) Jon Kukla references a Ft. Worth panel of scholars
discussed the DNA Evidence. If he would just read, no travel involved,
the research of the Scholars Commission he would get a different
approach to the controversy. I draw the reader's attention to pg. 52,
where TJ admitted when young and single he did see Mrs. Walker, HOWEVER
Jon Kukla says, "Jefferson acknowledged this and TJ said, "the only one,
founded in truth, among all their allegations against me." This is a
statement of TJ's condemnation of all of the other past rumors against
him.
A good time to now mention the motto of the Thomas Jefferson Heritage
Society, "For here we are not afraid follow truth wherever it may lead,
no to tolerate any error so long as reason is left free to combat it."
(a letter to William Roscoe on Dec. 27, 1820). Mr. Kukla's many uses of,
"hard to believe", "may well have been", "could easily have", "it is
possible to imagine", "IF", "it seems unlikely" and more such GUESSING
terminology, the reader gets the idea. Other than this one admission,
Jon where are any proofs to back up your Jefferson-Sally statements? On
pg. 250
Mr. Kukla brings to our attention the fact that the DNA tests of Peter
and Samuel Carr were no match....that would be for the only ONE Eston
Heming descendant, NOT all of her children.....and this is where
Monticello is remiss in claiming that possibly ALL of Sally's children
were fathered by TJ. This is impossible to state because of only one
being tested. I don't believe I saw any reference to the Waverly
Watchman opposition to the Wetmore/Madison Hemings article...."possibly"
an oversight!
You accuse me of not clearing my mind and not seeing the big picture.
You are absolutely incorrect in this shallow assessment. Since day one,
ten years ago, I have been involved in all phases with this controversy
and I know many things including the many agendas prevalent and WHY and
WHO the perpetrators are. Don't these false statements such as I have
outlined in Kukla's book and the many outlined in the Amazon book
reviews convince that these are "untruths".........see I didn't say lies
did I?
Herb Barger
Jefferson Family Historian
-----Original Message-----
From: Discussion of research and writing about Virginia history
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Anne Pemberton
Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2008 9:56 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [VA-HIST] PBS Misrepresentation of the truth on their web
page in Barger's opinion
Herb,
You are not going to like this statement, but I find all the material
you
claim to be "untruth" to be quite believable considering all the issues
involved.
I am now reading Jon Kukla's book and again, find it very logical, well
reasoned, and quite believable. It is measurably more believable than
what
you keep saying. Jefferson seems to have had great difficulty with
women,
considering them less worthy overall than men, and suited only to adorn
a
house. It's no wonder that the first woman he swooned over, turned him
down,
which he seemed to then blame on all the faults of women in general.
Seems
that the Walker case, as illustrated in Kukla's book was more than a
mere
indiscretion - but an all out effort to debase the wife of a close
friend.
Herb, it is always better to look at the broader picture. Limiting your
belief to only scientific testing is limiting your ability to approach
this
issue logically.
If you clear your mind of your prejudice, you may be able to let in a
little
sunshine and logic.
Anne
Anne Pemberton
[log in to unmask]
http://www.erols.com/apembert
http://www.educationalsynthesis.org
----- Original Message -----
From: "Herbert Barger" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2008 9:41 PM
Subject: PBS Misrepresentation of the truth on their web page in
Barger's
opinion
> Anne,
>
> Your statement is something from a "perfect world" and has no bearing
on
> this immediate subject. Editing is one thing but out and out removal
of
> a whole subject, in my opinion, is censorship and PBS did this.
>
> Not satisfied with this deletion, I call your attention to the PBS
> Frontline four video clips where "NOT TRUTH" was told at least on the
> Paris clip: "Sally came to France with Martha (untruth", it was Mary
> (Maria). Reference to half-sister (misunderstanding, nothing proves
this
> rumor true, see "Anatomy of a Scandal." Over to another clip,
> Monticello clip: "Jefferson children with Sally" and "His son,
Beverly."
> The only two I viewed was so sickening with untruths that I never
viewed
> the other two. Why don't these purveyors of family programming and
users
> of taxpayer support, at least research such web pages as, Scholars
> Commission Report (www.tjheritage.org) and many other factual places
of
> information? I encourage all readers contact PBS about this injustice
to
> a great founding father.
>
> This is so outrageous on a web page that proposes that children read
and
> view this stuff for their school programs. I will propose and will
> insist that PBS correct this "oversight" or should I use stronger
words?
>
>
> I have no problems with other people's views so long as they are based
> upon proven facts. Lanier's book and the PBS videos are NOT based upon
> fact......NOTHING proves Shannon's views that he is a descendant of
> Thomas Jefferson and the PBS videos have the same problem with
> truth....NO proof.... yet they mislead the public in this direction.
>
> I would advise teachers to refrain from recommending this site for
> Jefferson information UNTIL they correct these injustices to Mr.
> Jefferson's character and legacy.
>
> As far as the Isaac Jefferson interview (backing Madison's claims), by
> the same abolitionist, Samuel Wetmore, in another of his series, Life
> Among the Lowly, A Harriet Beecher Stowe, book, Uncle Tom's Cabin, I
> urge you to read TJ's grandson, Thomas Jefferson Randolph's scathing
> comments on this slave's NON KNOWLEDGE of the issue and the fact that
he
> could not have known facts that were attributed to him because of
> conflicts in his dates of birth, etc. Old Sam Wetmore was determined
to
> "bad mouth" TJ from all angles but more researchers are finding him
> WRONG. As you mention, I don't believe Sam Wetmore could have used a
> video because, I personally believe that "he may have doctored these
> articles to his own liking" OR possibly he would have used PBS
> tactics....just censor it out.
>
> You references to PBS editors intentions and editing, "if they were
> intent on factual presentation", is a laugh because IF they were,
where
> did their story "jump the track"......it was NOT factual in several
> instances.
>
> Thanks for your "ill-mannered" and "cocksure" remarks about
me.....when
> facts are lacking "always attack the messenger." Your wording
convinces
> me of your lack of knowledge of this subject all together.
>
> Herb Barger
> Jefferson Family Historian
>
>
>
>
> Herb,
>
> I am sure that anytime a tv station takes footage that it is submitted
> to an
> editorial staff, and slices of film hit the floor. I'm sure you are
> neither
> the first nor the last person who was interviewed for a broadcast and
> never
> saw themselves appear in the final show. Having read your interview in
> Lanier's book and comparing it to the other interviews in the book,
your
>
> lacks any sense of humility or consideration for other points of view.
> If in
> the PBS interview you referred to people you never met or knew, as
> LIARS, as
> you do on this list, it is likely that the editors at PBS may have
> considered your interview as an invitation to a trouble. If they were
> intent
> on a factual presentation, and if your are in person as illmannered
and
> cocksure of your "truth" as superior to the "truth" of other
> researchers,
> your interview with them was probably a disappointment.
>
> In any event, it seems that the PBS site includes the Primary Sources
> that
> teachers have a hard time presenting for students in a usable fasion.
> Certainly, it would have been better had the reporter been able to
sound
>
> record both Madison Hemings and Isaac Jefferson, but that technology
was
> not
> yet available.
>
> Anne
>
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