I have a book titled, Tuckahoes & Cohees (Sweet Briar College), which gives some insight into that period. One of my ancestors was part of a group in Amherst County, who met at the Old Keys Church in the late 1700's. They were Baptist and could not meet openly, but several Baptist Churches formed from this group. Prior to becoming a Baptist my ancestor was a member of the Episcopalian Church in Lancaster County. It is interesting that he had to leave and hide away to practice religous freedom. By the way, the Baptist during that period were against slavery.
Anita Wills
-- Paul Finkelman <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
Randy; You need to get over your paranoia about "yankee legends," and
while you are at it, read your texts more carefully; note Bradford writes:
Last "and which was not least," they wanted to lay a foundation for or
make some progress toward "the propagating and advancing the gospel of the
kingdom of Christ in those remote parts of the world."
This would imply that in fact religion was the most important reason for
the migration, as indeed it was. The Plymouth Separitists left for
Holland because they could not worship as they wanted in England, but
after beng discoruaged by life in Holland (in part there was too much
religious freedom for everyone) they returned to England where they
were just as unhappy.
The really important question is what you, or anyone else, means by
"religious freedom." The Plymouth Separatists and moreso the Mass. Bay
Puritans were interested in eh free exercise of religion for themselves,
to set up a Godly commonwealth where they would be free from the
oppression of Anglican Church, but fo course they were not interested in
religious diversity or free exercise for other. In that respect they
were pretty much like everyone else in the world (except the Dutch).
The Va. colony did not allow any religious dissent either, and
vigorously oppressed religious dissidents. Moreover, Virginia has the
clear dishonor of jailing Baptists ministers and other dissenters as
late as the 1780s.
Paul Finkelman
Randy Cabell wrote:
> GRREAT!!!!! Thanks so much for digging out the four points that I
> could not
> recall.
>
> But I DID recall that the highly touted reason that the Pilgrims came
> to the
> new world -- "religious freedom" -- was not in the top three. So much
> for
> another Yankee legend :))
>
> Randy Cabell
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "J. Douglas Deal" <[log in to unmask]>
> To: <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent: Friday, December 02, 2005 8:31 PM
> Subject: Re: northern bias
>
>
>> A closer reading of Bradford shows three reasons that related, in one
>> way
>> or another, to the heavy labor and hard lives they led in Holland and a
>> fourth reason that did not. The quoted passages are on pp.23-25 of
>> his OF
>> PLYMOUTH PLANTATION (Morison's Modern Library edition).
>>
>> 1) The "great labour and hard fare, with other inconveniences which they
>> underwent and were contented with" in Holland could not be endured by
>> others who wanted to join them.... "But it was thought that if a better
>> and easier place of living could be had, it would draw many and take
>> away
>> these discouragements. Yea, their pastor would often say that many of
>> those who both wrote and preached now against them, if they were in a
>> place where they might have liberty and live comfortably, they would
>> then
>> practice as they did."
>>
>> 2) Though people bore these difficulties cheerfully and with "resolute
>> courage," "yet old age began to steal on many of them; and their
>> great and
>> continual labours, with other crosses and sorrows, hastened it before
>> the
>> time," so that "within a few years more they would be in danger to
>> scatter, by necessities pressing them, or sink under their burdens or
>> both."
>>
>> 3) Their children, it was feared, were flirting with degeneracy and
>> corruption by following the "evil examples" around them "into
>> extravagant
>> and dangerous courses." This too was connected, in their parents' minds,
>> with hard labor: "As necessity was a taskmaster over them so they were
>> forced to be such, not only to their servants but in a sort to their
>> dearest children, the which as it did not a little wound the tender
>> hearts
>> of many a loving father and mother, so it produced likewise sundry
>> sad and
>> sorrowful effects. For many of their children that were of best
>> dispositions and gracious inclinations, having learned to beaar the yoke
>> in their youth and willing to bear part of their parents' burden, were
>> oftentimes so oppressed with their heavy labours that though their minds
>> were free and willing, yet their bodies bowed under the weight of the
>> same, and became decrepit in their early youth, the vigour of nature
>> being
>> consumed in the very bud as it were."
>>
>> 4) Last "and which was not least," they wanted to lay a foundation
>> for or
>> make some progress toward "the propagating and advancing the gospel
>> of the
>> kingdom of Christ in those remote parts of the world."
>>
>> Douglas Deal
>> Professor of History and Chair of History Department
>> State University of New York at Oswego
>> Oswego, NY 13126
>> [log in to unmask]
>> (315)-312-5632
>>
>> To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the
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>>
>
> To subscribe, change options, or unsubscribe, please see the instructions
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--
Paul Finkelman
Chapman Distinguished Professor of Law
University of Tulsa College of Law
3120 East 4th Place
Tulsa, OK 74104-3189
918-631-3706 (office)
918-631-2194 (fax)
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